User talk:咽頭べさ

Hello, Welcome to the user talk. မ္ၚဵုရအဴ၊ ဒုင်တၠုင်ဏာနူကဵုညးလွပ်ဓရီုကျာဏအ်ရအဴ။

Welcome

Welcome to Lingua Libre, 咽頭べさ!

Lingua Libre is a project which aims to build a collaborative multilingual audiovisual corpus under free licence in order to expand knowledge about languages and help online language communities to develop.
You can help us!
You can visit this page if you want to learn more about the project.

Before starting

You can create your User page by clicking on it. We recommend that you integrate the babel template onto it. It is very useful to indicate to others the languages you speak, and to facilitate finding other persons speaking your languages. If you are not familiar with wikicode, you can go to this demo User page, read the instructions and copy the prepared babel template, and then paste it onto your user page before adapting it to your information. You can then publish your User page!

Where to start?

• Follow the steps of the Record Wizard
• Think of the words you want to record. You may enter them one by one (live list), use an existing category from a Wiktionary or Wikipedia project, or create your own list.

Do you need help?

You can visit this help page where you will find advice for beginning your contributions on Lingua Libre. If you did not find the answer to your question, please ask it in the Chat room.

Good practice

• Try to avoid background noises during the recording
• Please listen to the pronunciations before uploading them
• Consider using an external microphone

Best regards! — WikiLucas (🖋️) 14:36, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

Mon language and lists

Hello @咽頭べさ welcome!

I noticed you made two recordings today: and .

There are two issues with these recordings:

• you pronounced the first word in Thai and the second one in Burmese (if the languages chosen are correct), but you wrote both words in English ("Mon people" and "dog"). On Lingua Libre, we write down the word in the language we record (and you can add the translation later, on the file page). Next time, please use the alphabet of the language you record instead of the English translation.
• The second issue is the bad sound quality. This is not your fault, we are currently dealing with sound issues. But one should always verify the content and the quality of one's recordings before uploading them to Wikimedia Commons.

These mistakes are not a big issue, but please take this advice into account before recording more words.

Again, welcome to Lingua Libre, don't hesitate to ask me any question on my talk page, or here 🙂

All the best, — WikiLucas (🖋️) 14:55, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

Hi, @WikiLucas00 , Actually, I want my audio file to be included in Mon language (mnw), Lingua Libre does not include Mon language, so I used mya for Dog Dog (Q555537)) and tha for Mon people Mon people (Q555440). Lingua Libre does not include Mon language, so I was very disappointed to continue using Lingua Libre. I am Mon people, I was born in Kawtut Village, Lamaing Township, Mon State, I have studied in 6 countries, Thailand, India, China, Myanmar, American, Korea and Japan. I intended to use Lingua Libre for the Mon language dictionary, but it was not possible to continue using Lingua Libre because Lingua Libre did not include Mon language, thanks.--咽頭べさ (talk) 07:43, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Hello 咽頭べさ, allow me to answer since I noticed your message.

Mon language (mnw) have been added into Lingualibre (Mon (Q555966)), so you now can record in it.

In Special:RecordWizard, step 2, add "Mon" to your user/speaker.

You will then need a list of Mon word to record and you are ready to go. This list under open license can be used. It's a computer generated list from wnw websites, so there is some noise (English), but it creates a starting point. Yug (talk) 08:29, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Hello@Yug ,I'm very happy to add Mon language, I will never forget the thanks of User Yug for adding Mon language. I'm going to test with an iPhone to get clear audio for audio files, I am the main author of the Mon dictionary. I do not know how to use Lingua Libre yet, so I have to learn, if I have made a mistake in Lingua Libre, please forgive me, thanks.--咽頭べさ (talk) 09:19, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Mon language was imported by WikiLucas ;), but I give an help by guiding you a bit.

Your first 100 audios may be a bit messy, but then you can re-record them when you have a good place (no noise), etc.

Iphones have good microphones and sound card, it's a good way to go for better audio, yes.

I just created the local List:mnw/Unilex : it will be more convenient from Iphone. You can load that list as follow :

1. In Special:RecordWizard's step 3
2. Set "You record words in:" to "Mon"
3. Click on "Local list", select that "mnw/Wiktionary" list.
4. Click on "Remove words already recorded"

Please also note that we are limited at 380 recording per 2 hours I believe. Our best contributors just upload 300 words/day but in a regular and playful fashion. ;) Yug (talk) 10:09, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

@Yug ,The List:mnw/Unilex you provided contains misspellings and terms not related to the Mon dictionary. Next, some of the "mnw/Unilex" vocabulary you gave me is already in the Commons, you can view it at c:Category:Mon pronunciation, thanks.--咽頭べさ (talk) 10:48, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

You can edit and improve List:mnw/Unilex as you edit any wiki page.

LinguaLibre creates a new audio datasets in your language within c:Category:Lingua Libre pronunciation-mnw. Given Lili's speed it will be faster (20~30mins) to re-record c:Category:Mon pronunciation's 370 words, and it's the way to go. To do so I created List:mnw/Commons. Remember to click "Remove words already recorded" when you proceed on Lingualibre.

For some time, both categories will exist. Yet, Lingualibre provides fast recording, standard naming convention, a bots to spread your audios to wiktionaries, so Lili should be your base approach to contribute new audios to Commons and to your dictionary. More tools are underway, as "download per language" and others, which your project will benefit from. Yug (talk) 11:39, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

@Yug ,I'm busy writing dictionary articles for Mon Wiktionary development, I am currently the only author of several dictionary articles on Mon Wiktionary, if you need Mon vocabulary you can check wikt:mnw:ဝိက်ရှေန်နရဳ:သ္ဍံၚ်/က, I have been working tirelessly for Mon Dictionary and Mon Wiktionary development, thanks.--咽頭べさ (talk) 15:37, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Nearly 2000 items in that page. It could be a nice « Mon dictionary for students » indeed. Yug (talk) 19:50, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Words

See also Help:Homographs

Hello 咽頭べさ, I answered to you on https://LinguaLibre.org . Yug (talk) 08:44, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Hi again,

Can you tell me why there is both File:Mnw-ကစေံ1.wav and File:Mnw-ကစေံ2.wav ? Are they the same word ? Yug (talk) 12:04, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

@Yug ,In Mon language, audio read and audio speak are often different, the pronunciation of the Mon language varies from region to region. the explanation of your question is as follows:

• Audio read
• Audio speak
• Translate=Bird

The vocabulary ကစေံ has up to seven pronunciations, there is also a different pronunciation of Thai Mon, Mon Te, Mon Korean, Mon Tang, Mon Nya, Mon Pali. The Mon language is not modern, but the Mon literature is very advanced, there are many secrets in Mon literature that not everyone knows, in the 2nd century AD, Mon literary scholars included many secrets in the Mon vocabulary to protect Mon literature, these secrets of Mon vocabulary are understood only by Mon scholars, thanks.--咽頭べさ (talk) 13:25, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Ok, so they are homographs (same writing) but not homophone (not same pronunciation), aka Heteronym.

For you Mon words, what is the difference between each ?

By example, in French, the following are homographs non homophones, the par between brackets is not read aloud in LinguaLibre :

• excellent (v), pronounced `excel`
• excellent (adj), pronounced `excellant`

In other language the same word can be pronounced differently if read by a man or woman, in that case we may record :

• vert (masculin), pronounced `ver`
• vert (féminin), pronounced `verte`

We can also differentiate by using a synonym :

• crooked (injured), pronounced `crookaid`
• crooked (corrupt), pronounced `crookt`

For Mon language, from my understanding, you should have things such as ကစေံ for today's standard Mon language.

Then ကစေံ (Thai), ကစေံ (Te), ကစေံ (Korean), ကစေံ (Tang), ကစေံ (Pali), ကစေံ (read), ကစေံ (speak).

But you have to edit the pages List:mnw/* BEFORE recording those items, and you have to keep concistent. Yug (talk) 14:34, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

咽頭べさ, given you want to create a clean dictionary for Mon language, I encourage you to take it as a middle term project and first clarify those issue on LinguaLibre:Chat_room or on Discord's #main. Yug (talk) 15:17, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

I noticed your first recordings, you can do better by following Help:Homographs and using # ကစေံ (Te) which is more solid than # ကစေံ/Mon Te, since:

• filenames recorded via Lili contains (mnw) which defining the Mon language, so you do not have to add `Mon` in the homograph.
• the sign / can cause bugs in later usages. Yug (talk) 21:58, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

thank you very much, I will try my best to be the best.--咽頭べさ (talk) 20:52, 13 January 2022 (UTC)

Hello 咽頭べさ, I see you are getting close. Using lower case for (read), (speak) is better, yes ! (🗨️ translate)

Remember to add a space between the word and the (. Without space the transcription data is incorrect :(.

ခၟာဲစာၚ်ၜိုဟ်(read) → ခၟာဲစာၚ်ၜိုဟ် (read) 👍🏽.

You are on the right track 👏🏽 🧙🏽‍♂️ 🎉 Yug (talk) 13:32, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Thanks, I will do my best, if you do not see 100% Mon characters on your computer, you can use the new Unicode font or MUA Office, I would like to inform you that if you use an old Unicode font on your computer, you will not be able to see 100% Mon characters.--咽頭べさ (talk) 21:38, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

I fixed this audio (🗨️ translate) (the fix)

You don't have to edit this yourself.

The correct way :

ခၟာဲစာၚ်ၜိုဟ် (read) (please see the white space between ခၟာဲစာၚ်ၜိုဟ် and (read))

transcription = ခၟာဲစာၚ်ၜိုဟ်

qualifier = read.

When you record a word, if ခၟာဲစာၚ်ၜိုဟ် (read) has a white space " " before (read), then all will be fine. Yug (talk) 21:25, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

Local lists (faster)

Hello 咽頭べさ, did you try to load the "Local list" in step 3 ?
Following your informations I created 3 local lists:

• List:mnw/Wiktionary (~1900 from wikt:mnw:ဝိက်ရှေန်နရဳ:သ္ဍံၚ်/က) → I advise you to do ~300 or 20mins per day. 6x20mins.
• List:mnw/Commons (~370) → clean up and change suffixes, click "Remove words already recorded", then <10mins
• List:mnw/Unilex (~3000 but a part of noise) → clean up, click "Remove words already recorded" then 3x20mins

You can edit those wiki pages to add the * (Speak), * (Read), * (Tang), … suffixes where needed.

Then in Special:RecordWizard, step 3:

1. Set "You record words in:" to "Mon"
2. Click on "Local list", search for or click on "mnw/Wiktionary".
3. Click on "Remove words already recorded"
4. Go to step 4 to record.

Ping me if you need help, I'm happy to help to let Mon be better known around :D Yug (talk) 19:50, 14 January 2022 (UTC)